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1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
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Amazing1 Offline
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Post: #1
1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
Good Afternoon to Everyone. I am trying to "upgrade" the wetcell that I had in my car, so please help me do this. I am not interested in starting all over with a dry cell design at this time.

Today I emersed a plate config - NNNN + using Lowes SS switch plates.
all plates are connected using nylon fittings except of course where the + and - wires are attached at each end.

This config produced some small bubbles from the + and N plate right next to it, as well as the - plate, but the other two N plates didn't seem to have a single bubble. I cut my own 3/16" (approximate size) nylon spacers and the plates appear to be somewhat close together.

A friend used a multi-meter where you "surround" the wire and it never produced even a single amp reading, despite our producing some bubbles.

Does anyone have any suggestions to improve upon this plate/wetcell configuration, or what my friend could have been doing wrong with the multimeter? It's not possible to produce no amps, right?
09-08-2010 03:24 PM
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martinruf Offline
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Post: #2
RE: 1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
(09-08-2010 03:24 PM)Amazing1 Wrote:  Today I emersed a plate config - NNNN + using Lowes SS switch plates.
all plates are connected using nylon fittings except of course where the + and - wires are attached at each end. This config produced some small bubbles from the + and N plate right next to it, as well as the - plate, but the other two N plates didn't seem to have a single bubble.
A friend used a multi-meter where you "surround" the wire and it never produced even a single amp reading, despite our producing some bubbles.
It's not possible to produce no amps, right?
I have no information about size of your plate. We all use something in the water to make it useable. I use a small amount of KOH till the amp goes up to 1-2 amp through the hole cell. My wet-cell ist a -NNNNN+NNNNN-
My car works well with 1-2 amp (only a very small amount of bubbles) and 22% (-1.5l / 100km) less. More amp kill the saving.

Ford C-Max 1.8i flexfuel (petrol)
Victor-Tupperware-Cell
4x 5N at 1-2AMP
20% less Liter/100km
09-09-2010 11:47 PM
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Ryanrpm Offline
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Post: #3
RE: 1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
Yeah, sounds like you have no electrolyte in your water.

Purchased! The AquaThrustPlus. Installed on my engine: Tundra 4.7L

[Image: f_emp3hbpw24tm_bcf4d7d.jpg] [Image: f_d32qa8uwm_b9baaff.jpg]

My next mods: Envalve, Vapor Assist.
09-10-2010 02:19 AM
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Amazing1 Offline
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Post: #4
RE: 1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
(09-09-2010 11:47 PM)martinruf Wrote:  
(09-08-2010 03:24 PM)Amazing1 Wrote:  Today I emersed a plate config - NNNN + using Lowes SS switch plates.
all plates are connected using nylon fittings except of course where the + and - wires are attached at each end. This config produced some small bubbles from the + and N plate right next to it, as well as the - plate, but the other two N plates didn't seem to have a single bubble.
A friend used a multi-meter where you "surround" the wire and it never produced even a single amp reading, despite our producing some bubbles.
It's not possible to produce no amps, right?
I have no information about size of your plate. We all use something in the water to make it useable. I use a small amount of KOH till the amp goes up to 1-2 amp through the hole cell. My wet-cell ist a -NNNNN+NNNNN-
My car works well with 1-2 amp (only a very small amount of bubbles) and 22% (-1.5l / 100km) less. More amp kill the saving.

My plates are the size of a standard home light switch plate, around 3" by 5". And to respond to your and the "next" person, I most definitely have around 2 tablespoons, if not more of baking soda in the tank with my test plates.

I did find out something interesting, that the reason we did not register any amps was likely to the fact that any car with an alternator does not produce DC current, but is actually an AC current. My friend and his multimeter has not made it back over to my house since this posting.
09-10-2010 11:43 AM
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benny Offline
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Post: #5
RE: 1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
(09-10-2010 11:43 AM)Amazing1 Wrote:  
(09-09-2010 11:47 PM)martinruf Wrote:  
(09-08-2010 03:24 PM)Amazing1 Wrote:  Today I emersed a plate config - NNNN + using Lowes SS switch plates.
all plates are connected using nylon fittings except of course where the + and - wires are attached at each end. This config produced some small bubbles from the + and N plate right next to it, as well as the - plate, but the other two N plates didn't seem to have a single bubble.
A friend used a multi-meter where you "surround" the wire and it never produced even a single amp reading, despite our producing some bubbles.
It's not possible to produce no amps, right?
I have no information about size of your plate. We all use something in the water to make it useable. I use a small amount of KOH till the amp goes up to 1-2 amp through the hole cell. My wet-cell ist a -NNNNN+NNNNN-
My car works well with 1-2 amp (only a very small amount of bubbles) and 22% (-1.5l / 100km) less. More amp kill the saving.

My plates are the size of a standard home light switch plate, around 3" by 5". And to respond to your and the "next" person, I most definitely have around 2 tablespoons, if not more of baking soda in the tank with my test plates.

I did find out something interesting, that the reason we did not register any amps was likely to the fact that any car with an alternator does not produce DC current, but is actually an AC current. My friend and his multimeter has not made it back over to my house since this posting.

1. Car alternators have an inbuilt rectifier, so they do produce DC electricity (rectified 3-phase).
2. Dump the baking soda and get hold of some NaOH or KOH. Have a look at drain cleaner from you local DIY store. Some contan NaOH (sodium hydroxide) as the main ingredient. Baking soda produces sludge.
3. Try wiring your unit across the battery to see if that produces anything. Have an inline fuse in your circuit, just in case.
3. Is your friends multimeter capable of reading DC with the type of detector/sensor you describe? That type of sensor, used with standard multimeters, is usually limited to AC. Clamp meters for DC are expensive.
4. I suggest you also do a bit more reading on the subject of HHO production.
(This post was last modified: 09-11-2010 03:19 AM by benny.)
09-11-2010 03:11 AM
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Amazing1 Offline
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Post: #6
RE: 1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
(09-11-2010 03:11 AM)benny Wrote:  
(09-10-2010 11:43 AM)Amazing1 Wrote:  
(09-09-2010 11:47 PM)martinruf Wrote:  
(09-08-2010 03:24 PM)Amazing1 Wrote:  Today I emersed a plate config - NNNN + using Lowes SS switch plates.
all plates are connected using nylon fittings except of course where the + and - wires are attached at each end. This config produced some small bubbles from the + and N plate right next to it, as well as the - plate, but the other two N plates didn't seem to have a single bubble.
A friend used a multi-meter where you "surround" the wire and it never produced even a single amp reading, despite our producing some bubbles.
It's not possible to produce no amps, right?
I have no information about size of your plate. We all use something in the water to make it useable. I use a small amount of KOH till the amp goes up to 1-2 amp through the hole cell. My wet-cell ist a -NNNNN+NNNNN-
My car works well with 1-2 amp (only a very small amount of bubbles) and 22% (-1.5l / 100km) less. More amp kill the saving.

My plates are the size of a standard home light switch plate, around 3" by 5". And to respond to your and the "next" person, I most definitely have around 2 tablespoons, if not more of baking soda in the tank with my test plates.

I did find out something interesting, that the reason we did not register any amps was likely to the fact that any car with an alternator does not produce DC current, but is actually an AC current. My friend and his multimeter has not made it back over to my house since this posting.

1. Car alternators have an inbuilt rectifier, so they do produce DC electricity (rectified 3-phase).
2. Dump the baking soda and get hold of some NaOH or KOH. Have a look at drain cleaner from you local DIY store. Some contan NaOH (sodium hydroxide) as the main ingredient. Baking soda produces sludge.
3. Try wiring your unit across the battery to see if that produces anything. Have an inline fuse in your circuit, just in case.
3. Is your friends multimeter capable of reading DC with the type of detector/sensor you describe? That type of sensor, used with standard multimeters, is usually limited to AC. Clamp meters for DC are expensive.
4. I suggest you also do a bit more reading on the subject of HHO production.

Thanks for your suggestions Benny. I have since starting this thread made a few changes which I think some of you would find interesting:

#1) I'm well aware of the use of KOH or NaOH, however being that this is just a TEST outside of my car, and that I happen to have some baking soda handy, which is known to work, that is why I elected to use it for my test.

#2) On the suggestion of someone else who has "tinkered" with a wet cell HHO Generator, I changed my switch plate config to + NN - NN + and using the very same liquid bath this configuration produced a who bunch of gas bubbles. so much so that when I turned off my car you could hear the hissing of the bubbles coming to the surface. So clearly, there is a better way to make Hydrogen gas than a + NNNNN - configuration.

#3) I'm no longer worrying at this point about the amps. I am simply going to purchase a digital ammeter and install it inside my passenger compartment once all my testing of different plates is concluded.

#4) I doubt doing any more reading is going to teach me anything that I haven't seen already, although I wish there would be some more definitive, definite information about 02 sensors, using foil to "fool" the sensors and how to get the EFIE set correctly so that it works and doesn't involve a whole bunch of trial and error.
09-11-2010 09:25 AM
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benny Offline
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Post: #7
RE: 1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
Quote:#1) I'm well aware of the use of KOH or NaOH, however being that this is just a TEST outside of my car, and that I happen to have some baking soda handy, which is known to work, that is why I elected to use it for my test.

OK. I can live with that, but baking soda is NOT recommended for long term use for the reason given.

Quote:#2) On the suggestion of someone else who has "tinkered" with a wet cell HHO Generator, I changed my switch plate config to + NN - NN + and using the very same liquid bath this configuration produced a who bunch of gas bubbles. so much so that when I turned off my car you could hear the hissing of the bubbles coming to the surface. So clearly, there is a better way to make Hydrogen gas than a + NNNNN - configuration.

+NN-NN+ is not the way to go. You will produce an excessively high voltage between adjacent plates when connected to a battery or fitted to your car. Yes, you will get lots of bubbles, but you will also get lots of steam, and heat, neither of which are desirable.

Quote:#3) I'm no longer worrying at this point about the amps. I am simply going to purchase a digital ammeter and install it inside my passenger compartment once all my testing of different plates is concluded.

I would suggest that 'worrying about amps' should be one of your main concerns when testing your unit for gas (HHO) production. You should be aiming for the greatest volume of HHO production, for the least current draw. Efficiency. Wasting energy on producing steam is not desirable.

Quote:#4) I doubt doing any more reading is going to teach me anything that I haven't seen already, although I wish there would be some more definitive, definite information about 02 sensors, using foil to "fool" the sensors and how to get the EFIE set correctly so that it works and doesn't involve a whole bunch of trial and error.

It's amazing what you learn from reading, and re-reading, texts. Most people simply scan text looking for particular pieces of information, rather than do an in-depth read of whatever, and, by doing so, usually skip the most important information contained therein.
As for trial and error, there are just too many differences between different makes of vehicle, and even between supposedly identical makes and models of same, that it would be all but impossible to set down a definitive set of rules for setting up Effie, O2 sensor mods, etc. etc. which would be ideal for all vehicles.
Most installations will require tweaking, in one form or another, for max performance gain. Note: By performance I mean the effectiveness of what you want to achieve. Not necessarily power gain.
(This post was last modified: 09-12-2010 01:11 AM by benny.)
09-12-2010 01:09 AM
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plbgbutcrack Offline
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Post: #8
RE: 1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
(09-08-2010 03:24 PM)Amazing1 Wrote:  Good Afternoon to Everyone. I am trying to "upgrade" the wetcell that I had in my car, so please help me do this. I am not interested in starting all over with a dry cell design at this time.

Today I emersed a plate config - NNNN + using Lowes SS switch plates.
all plates are connected using nylon fittings except of course where the + and - wires are attached at each end.

This config produced some small bubbles from the + and N plate right next to it, as well as the - plate, but the other two N plates didn't seem to have a single bubble. I cut my own 3/16" (approximate size) nylon spacers and the plates appear to be somewhat close together.

A friend used a multi-meter where you "surround" the wire and it never produced even a single amp reading, despite our producing some bubbles.

Does anyone have any suggestions to improve upon this plate/wetcell configuration, or what my friend could have been doing wrong with the multimeter? It's not possible to produce no amps, right?

Get out of inches and space in mm
Dont use chemicals.....bad
Straight water is all that is needed.
Space your plates as to your required amp's you want,
And control water temp.

Have fun
(This post was last modified: 10-01-2010 04:06 AM by plbgbutcrack.)
10-01-2010 03:59 AM
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Roland Jacques Offline
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Post: #9
RE: 1st Plate Test ... Any Ideas?
Quote:#4) I doubt doing any more reading is going to teach me anything that I haven't seen already, although I wish there would be some more definitive, definite information about 02 sensors, using foil to "fool" the sensors and how to get the EFIE set correctly so that it works and doesn't involve a whole bunch of trial and error.

Thier always the Volo chips mod, That does keep it simple result vary.
As far as EFIIs and MAP and MAF enhacers, Mike here is top notch with this stuff . but there is no one size fits all when it come to hunderds of different cars.

Baking soda may work OK, but your concetration may be on the low side.

If you hear bubbles after you cell Off, you may have been boiling water.
10-01-2010 04:48 AM
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