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57 MPG and increasing! (89 mpg update)
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Rags Offline
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Post: #21
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
colchiro Wrote:Rags, my bubbler is made of 1 inch tubing with barb to pipe fittings and each end has a cap that I drilled and tapped to fit the smaller barb fittings I needed. I position it vertically with water in the bottom and it works fine. You could use a larger diameter tube if needed. Here is a pic with showing the entire setup.
Ok the picture helped a lot. I think I will make up something like that. I thought it had to be bigger to accomplish working as a Flash Killer.
Rags
04-30-2008 07:21 PM
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Rags Offline
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Post: #22
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
tanahiro Wrote:well in my particular situation, i have a 2006 pontiac grand prix with 2 smack booster a efie. oxy extender, resistor in maf and iat and cts, and i see 0 gain. iam very dissap. all af this in which i decide to eliminate everything and put in the trash. my car right now is giving me only less than 180 mile in half tank.
I have a 2002 Pontiac Sunfire.
I experienced a blown fuse last week and I don't know what the cause was. so I gutted everything, except the extender for the aft 02 sensor. I checked the milage w/o anything on the car and got 29+ mpg. The car is rated at 24 mpg, this is what I was using for a base when I added the hho generator. When I tested the mpg's with the generator it went between 27 and 29 mpg's. So I guess from that I really didn't gain anything.
Gas here just went to $3.75 a gallon so thought I would try again. I have found that if I wasn't pulling at least 10 amps with the generator, the amount of hho I was producing was minimal. Between 10 and 15 amps the production seemed to be much higher. If the information I have read is correct, and I am producing enough hho my gas mileage should decrease as soon as the computer reads there is too much oxygen in the system. My only concern at this point is that 15 amps may create too much heat w/o having a system to recycle the electrolyte. I just don't have enough room under my hood to install all of this stuff. If my mpg's remains the same with the hho in operation and doesn't go down or up, I may just scrap the whole thing. I guess 29 mpg city driving isn't too bad but could be better I'm sure. I am a bit puzzled about getting 57 mpg with just the hho generator, it seems to go against all of the information I have read about how the system should react. If I went to 57 mpg, I would not even worry about installing an EFIE. For me to get to 57 mpg's I would have to get an increase of 51%.
(This post was last modified: 05-01-2008 07:35 AM by Rags.)
05-01-2008 07:34 AM
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wulfram Offline
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Post: #23
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
Rags Wrote:I am a bit puzzled about getting 57 mpg with just the hho generator, it seems to go against all of the information I have read about how the system should react. If I went to 57 mpg, I would not even worry about installing an EFIE. For me to get to 57 mpg's I would have to get an increase of 51%.

57 mpg is good... 85 would be betterBig Grin. I'm thinking of installing a second HHO gen after the EFIE (depending on how the EFIE takes to). Bit wary of the amps that would be pulled with a 2nd, but if it starts dropping mpg's instead of raising them.. I'll just revert back to the last best thing that worked.
I understand the wonder of why it is working so well on my vehicle right now without EFIE, and perhaps it is either a defective o2 working for me instead of against me - or the tinfoil wrap trick is actually working! Laugh
05-01-2008 03:52 PM
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Rags Offline
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Post: #24
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
wulfram Wrote:
Rags Wrote:I am a bit puzzled about getting 57 mpg with just the hho generator, it seems to go against all of the information I have read about how the system should react. If I went to 57 mpg, I would not even worry about installing an EFIE. For me to get to 57 mpg's I would have to get an increase of 51%.

57 mpg is good... 85 would be betterBig Grin. I'm thinking of installing a second HHO gen after the EFIE (depending on how the EFIE takes to). Bit wary of the amps that would be pulled with a 2nd, but if it starts dropping mpg's instead of raising them.. I'll just revert back to the last best thing that worked.
I understand the wonder of why it is working so well on my vehicle right now without EFIE, and perhaps it is either a defective o2 working for me instead of against me - or the tinfoil wrap trick is actually working! Laugh
I haven't heard about wrapping the 02 sensor in foil, what is the purpose of doing that? You might try running the generators in series, that cuts down on the amperage draw. You must have a bunch of room under your hood. I could barely get a piece of 3" pvc under mine, let along thinking of putting two.
05-01-2008 04:48 PM
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Rags Offline
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Post: #25
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
Rags Wrote:
colchiro Wrote:Rags, my bubbler is made of 1 inch tubing with barb to pipe fittings and each end has a cap that I drilled and tapped to fit the smaller barb fittings I needed. I position it vertically with water in the bottom and it works fine. You could use a larger diameter tube if needed. Here is a pic with showing the entire setup.
Ok the picture helped a lot. I think I will make up something like that. I thought it had to be bigger to accomplish working as a Flash Killer.
Rags
Got my new bubbler up and bubbling in the car, burned the tubbing from leaning against the exhaust pipe DUH. Fixed that and moved thing around a bit now seems to be working fine. Sure takes up a lot less room.
05-01-2008 04:52 PM
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jksav7 Offline
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Post: #26
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
I'm sure you're not ambitious enough to try this, but it would be interesting to see what your mpg numbers are without the tinfoil on the O2 sensor.


wulfram Wrote:I understand the wonder of why it is working so well on my vehicle right now without EFIE, and perhaps it is either a defective o2 working for me instead of against me - or the tinfoil wrap trick is actually working! Laugh
05-01-2008 04:59 PM
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Rags Offline
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Post: #27
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
jksav7 Wrote:I'm sure you're not ambitious enough to try this, but it would be interesting to see what your mpg numbers are without the tinfoil on the O2 sensor.


wulfram Wrote:I understand the wonder of why it is working so well on my vehicle right now without EFIE, and perhaps it is either a defective o2 working for me instead of against me - or the tinfoil wrap trick is actually working! Laugh
jksav7
I ment to ask you the question instead of wulfram, Do you know benefit of putting the aluminum foil around the 02 sensor?
05-01-2008 05:07 PM
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jksav7 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
No, I don't. I tried it on my Toyota pickup, but it did nothing for me. I know someone on another forum who tried it, and it set off his SES light. Then there are the stories of great success.

Wrapping the sensor will make it hotter. How does that help things? I don't know. I've heard it said that the sensor not only takes oxygen measurements from inside the pipe but that it takes measurements from outside of it as well. That means that it is taking measurements on the external part of the sensor. When I look at the sensor I don't see how that's possible or where there is any place to sense oxygen except on the probe, which is internal to the exhaust pipe. If there was a way for the sensor to measure the oxygen external to the exhause pipe then wrapping it theoretically would prevent it from reading that external oxygen, therefore reducing the difference in oxygen content between the inside of the pipe and the outside air. I don't believe, however, that this is what's happening.

So, I don't know what to think of it.


jksav7
I ment to ask you the question instead of wulfram, Do you know benefit of putting the aluminum foil around the 02 sensor?
[/quote]
(This post was last modified: 05-01-2008 06:09 PM by jksav7.)
05-01-2008 06:05 PM
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Rags Offline
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Post: #29
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
jksav7 Wrote:No, I don't. I tried it on my Toyota pickup, but it did nothing for me. I know someone on another forum who tried it, and it set off his SES light. Then there are the stories of great success.

Wrapping the sensor will make it hotter. How does that help things? I don't know. I've heard it said that the sensor not only takes oxygen measurements from inside the pipe but that it takes measurements from outside of it as well. That means that it is taking measurements on the external part of the sensor. When I look at the sensor I don't see how that's possible or where there is any place to sense oxygen except on the probe, which is internal to the exhaust pipe. If there was a way for the sensor to measure the oxygen external to the exhause pipe then wrapping it theoretically would prevent it from reading that external oxygen, therefore reducing the difference in oxygen content between the inside of the pipe and the outside air. I don't believe, however, that this is what's happening.

So, I don't know what to think of it.
There isn't enough of the 02 sensor sticking out that I could put any foil on it anyway. So I won't worry about it.


jksav7
I ment to ask you the question instead of wulfram, Do you know benefit of putting the aluminum foil around the 02 sensor?
[/quote]
05-01-2008 06:22 PM
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rpatzer Offline
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Post: #30
RE: 57 MPG and increasing!
rags-you said " I am a bit puzzled about getting 57 mpg with just the hho generator, it seems to go against all of the information I have read about how the system should react. If I went to 57 mpg, I would not even worry about installing an EFIE. For me to get to 57 mpg's I would have to get an increase of 51%."

The Honda Insight has the broad band O2 sensor. It has two cats, the extra one to handle the higher NOX from running very lean. It has a 22:1 AFR ratio and it averages 63 MPG. http://www.greencarcongress.com/2005/03/...sub_r.html Our older cars don't meet any of these concepts. I am hoping for a 20-25% gain from my mods.
(This post was last modified: 05-01-2008 08:21 PM by rpatzer.)
05-01-2008 08:11 PM
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