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Building a dry cell...first timer
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2001rotax800 Offline
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Post: #1
Building a dry cell...first timer
First off what a great bunch of people there are here. I am planning on building a dry type cell for my Chevrolet 8.1 liter. From what I have read so far, I am going to need atleast 1/2 of the engine displacment so about 4.0 L/M. I plan on doing much more reading but I am leaning torwards 2 seperate cells to keep the heat and amps down.

My concern is the effect it will have on my O2 sensors, and how much it will raise my fuel delivery demand. I have a custom programmed ecm for my motor and I have contacted the person who modifed it, I told him I expect to deliver 4.0 liters a minute. He replied to me:

Ok...in a minute, your engine has
consumed 600 grams of air (by weight) in a minute or 1.32lbs of air
Air weighs around .0100lbs per gallon...or 132 gallons of air.

So your HHo ratio at an idle is 1 to 132, or enough fuel to make a
difference of 0.007% to the incoming air charge at idle.

So....if my math is wrong, The generator won't make a difference.



Anyone have an opinion? Only time will tell, I currently get 9 mpg around town, and 13 hwy, as a baseline.
05-03-2011 10:21 AM
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comrevkr Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Building a dry cell...first timer
(05-03-2011 10:21 AM)2001rotax800 Wrote:  First off what a great bunch of people there are here. I am planning on building a dry type cell for my Chevrolet 8.1 liter. From what I have read so far, I am going to need atleast 1/2 of the engine displacment so about 4.0 L/M. I plan on doing much more reading but I am leaning torwards 2 seperate cells to keep the heat and amps down.

My concern is the effect it will have on my O2 sensors, and how much it will raise my fuel delivery demand. I have a custom programmed ecm for my motor and I have contacted the person who modifed it, I told him I expect to deliver 4.0 liters a minute. He replied to me:

Ok...in a minute, your engine has
consumed 600 grams of air (by weight) in a minute or 1.32lbs of air
Air weighs around .0100lbs per gallon...or 132 gallons of air.

So your HHo ratio at an idle is 1 to 132, or enough fuel to make a
difference of 0.007% to the incoming air charge at idle.

So....if my math is wrong, The generator won't make a difference.



Anyone have an opinion? Only time will tell, I currently get 9 mpg around town, and 13 hwy, as a baseline.

Cool Okay, first off, the hho will affect the the O2 sensors and You need to setup an efie for each of them so they can tell the ecm that your air to fuel ratio is still 14.7 t0 1. If not they will read an extremely lean mixture and cause the ecm to pump more fuel to bring the ratio back into play. 4lpm for you is right and that should if all the other factors are working properly in which none of us has perfected it yet. But we are trying hard. Some more into and better than most. Should and will increase your MPG'S and give you the satisfaction to tell the naysayers they haven't a clue. I learned more from these guys here than any other site. Make sure you fill out the efie form so your can get the right setup and make sure everything workes like it should on the bench first. So incase of a mishap or unseen problem, you won't damage your ride. Wink The "n" plates you asked about are there to reduce the amount of voltage between cells because you want less than 2v per plate, This will handle the heating problem and make your unit more efficent. Every one is here to help and guide and some of these guys are a great wealth of info. Good luck and be safe.

Cool
1994 Mazda B3000 3.0L V-6
400k+ miles and still going strongBig Grin
05-03-2011 02:17 PM
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2001rotax800 Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Building a dry cell...first timer
Thanks for the reply. I spoke with the ECM programmer and he did not say if there was room for more fuel delivery or not, I know he tuned up my F/A ratio's for increase performance. I will wait and see.

On another note. I have done some caulculations, and I am considering a tube with in a tube so to speak. I simple 1" SS tube 12" long has just over 75 square inches of surface area (both sides in and out) a 6"circle which is only 78% of the area of a square of teh same size only has 56.5 square inches of surface area. Why aren't more cylinder set ups used? They have more surface area.
05-04-2011 05:41 AM
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MtnGoatXJ Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Building a dry cell...first timer
I have built and bought generators that the have a surface area of approx 300 sq/in. The best my tests could mfgr is 1-1.5 L/min.

A new investment for my 4.0 liter engine is a gen with over 1000sq/in of surface area. Testing will begin soon.
05-04-2011 10:20 PM
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mike Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Building a dry cell...first timer
Hi 2001rotax800,

Welcome to the forum.

You should go to this page: http://www.fuelsaver-mpg.com/documents . Read the very first document at the top of the page. It will explain the mechanics of why you need to adjust your oxygen sensors even though a trivial amount of oxygen is being added to the intake.

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05-14-2011 07:51 AM
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2001rotax800 Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Building a dry cell...first timer
(05-14-2011 07:51 AM)mike Wrote:  Hi 2001rotax800,

Welcome to the forum.

You should go to this page: http://www.fuelsaver-mpg.com/documents . Read the very first document at the top of the page. It will explain the mechanics of why you need to adjust your oxygen sensors even though a trivial amount of oxygen is being added to the intake.

Thank you, I have done alot of reading and have yet to find ayone with success on an 8.1 liter motor. I am continuing to read and learn and brainstorm. I want to do something. I have acess to everything I need, weather it be tools or materials, I just want to make sure I have a shot at improving my MPG.
05-14-2011 02:34 PM
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mike Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Building a dry cell...first timer
Gads. The only difference between an 8.1 liter engine and a 4 liter engine is that you need twice as much HHO. They work exactly the same. My experience is that every one gets gains with HHO. Sometimes it takes some extra work to debug a system, or maybe add another sensor handler in extreme cases, but HHO just works. If gains don't happen it's because something is wrong - wrongly installed, or perhaps wrong with the car. But most people get good gains without doing anything special.

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05-15-2011 09:45 AM
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