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Electrical Diverter
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Smudge Offline
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Post: #1
Electrical Diverter
Here's photographic demonstration of my progress on the Electrical Diverter circuit from Eagle Research. This circuit intercepts the signals from the fuel injection computer going to each fuel injector and diverts the signal accordance with feedback from the O2 sensor allowing for direct control of injection to compensate for excessive fuel vapors created by secondary fuel vapor systems.

Not shown are the large 20W resistors that absorb the fuel injector signals if diverted by the mosfets shown on the top of the board or the wiring harness.


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10-14-2009 06:22 PM
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martinruf Offline
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RE: Electrical Diverter
(10-14-2009 06:22 PM)Smudge Wrote:  Electrical Diverter circuit from Eagle Research. This circuit intercepts the signals from the fuel injection computer going to each fuel injector

I have my part for the ED also prepared. We will make in the coming weeks, the installation in the car.

What should I consider when installing?
The circuit needs to be split. The potentiometer and the LED to be must at the wheel, because I had to make settings during the trip. The 20W resistors with the MOSFET probably quite close to the injection.
How did you solve it?

What should I consider during the setting?
Can cause loss of weight too great heat in the cylinder? In HyCo2 manual mentions nothing about it, because it is not relevant?

Thank you for your experience

Ford C-Max 1.8i flexfuel (petrol)
Victor-Tupperware-Cell
4x 5N at 1-2AMP
20% less Liter/100km
10-19-2009 11:55 PM
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Smudge Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Electrical Diverter
(10-19-2009 11:55 PM)martinruf Wrote:  
(10-14-2009 06:22 PM)Smudge Wrote:  Electrical Diverter circuit from Eagle Research. This circuit intercepts the signals from the fuel injection computer going to each fuel injector

I have my part for the ED also prepared. We will make in the coming weeks, the installation in the car.


We're at exactly the same stage, needing to make an outline or flow chart of where the electronics go in with the wiring harness. The person who gave my primer on electronics convinced me that 20w will put out gobs of heat and to put them on their own huge heatsink slab and their own board which I haven't done yet. Alex and George both say that the resistors and all the electronics can be on one board, that the heat isn't bad at all.
Personally I wouldn't want any mosfets of MINE to be under the non temperature controlled WET environment anywhere in the enginie bay.
I bought a pile of male/female paired spade connections. I'll just cut the fuel injections wires and male/female spade connect the wiring harness to the injector resistors in case I ever want to de-install the ED for tuning, repair, or transfer to another car. That's how I had my EFIE wired into the 02 wire and I've been glad of the fact when I had 2 cars of the same model and at the time only the one EFIE.
I'll write out a diagram of how I flowchart the resistors and harness and post it.
Likely I'll have some red and white wires a foot long going from the circuit board to the resistors' board and mount it outside my yet-to-be-purchased component box, and the harness wires from the main board 5 foot long with the splice tips going from the dash mounted box., through the firewall to the injectors.
I realize that sentence is hard to read but it's the best way to explain it. I have yet to solve it in theory.


What should I consider when installing?
The circuit needs to be split. The potentiometer and the LED to be must at the wheel, because I had to make settings during the trip. The 20W resistors with the MOSFET probably quite close to the injection.
How did you solve it?

What should I consider during the setting?
Can cause loss of weight too great heat in the cylinder? In HyCo2 manual mentions nothing about it, because it is not relevant?
Thank you for your experience

The hyco2 manual did mention it. Sais that it was designed for water injection installation. I'm surprised the water install isn't more common topic with people doing the hho. HHO's going to cause some high temperatures due to its 5 milisecond burn of 3,000 degrees.
One of the biggest arguments that has kept the OEM's from using hho in production cars from years has been the concern that it would increase oxides of nitrogen. I've been telling myself for years that I don't need to get a colortune, but I'm comming to the conclusion that to really tune my high mileage car I really need one. It appears that fabrication and construction is not the difficulty preventing the type of people who would visit these forums from having consistent, reliable fuel economy gains.
It's the tuning of hho production, fuel computer handling or whatever mods are made. With a colortune, I can know what exactly is really going on in my engine while it's happening instead of the "change something and drive 200-2000 miles" method of testing. Some people get modest results, a few get amazing ones and an unknown number get poor results.
It's like rolling dice or something until we know hot to tune well.
10-20-2009 11:14 AM
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AlexR Offline
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RE: Electrical Diverter
I looked at the pics above and don't see anything wrong. My one comment is that I assume those MOSFETs are going to get heatsinks?

The smaller MOSFETs on the bottom of the board can be put into the 8 pin IC holders you have for the 555 chip. This will avoid the hot temps from soldering and they can be easily replaced if need be.

I built one of these for my 1993 Jeep Wrangler. I used it for deceleration shutoff of the fuel and got a gain of about 25% to almost 35%. Note that this was using the decel shutoff only, no EFIE, no other form of fuel saver. Gains were greatest in city/country driving where one would take advantage of the deceleration. There was virtually no gain on the highway as I never used the deceleration for any appreciable length of time to make a difference. I imagine larger/longer hills out west would be different.

I installed mine in the cabin with the wires running to the injectors. I made a plug on the box so I could remove it if I needed to. In its place I had a plug with jumpers that would complete the circuit for the injectors. This was also a handy anti-theft feature, no plug, no power to the injectors!

It all fit into a large project box from Radio Shack with plenty of holes drilled for ventilation. I even added a fan, but don't think it was necessary.

Alex

Cool Flame, LLC
http://www.cool-flame.com
11-15-2009 05:56 AM
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martinruf Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Electrical Diverter
yesterday, we tried to build in the ED in my car.
But it didn't work at all.

On the schema js-svgRender you will see, that the positive is always here. The flow-control will make the car-computer from the negative. We hooked the ED on the negative before the injectors.
"From the computer" is from the negativ.
"To the injectors" goes to the injectors and from there to the positive.

The R10 resistors aren't enough to cut the signal, so we think.

The schema for the ED is only a short time here. But to help us you have to see it. (shema removed)
Any ideas to help us? What we have to change?


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Ford C-Max 1.8i flexfuel (petrol)
Victor-Tupperware-Cell
4x 5N at 1-2AMP
20% less Liter/100km
(This post was last modified: 12-14-2009 09:35 PM by martinruf.)
12-01-2009 02:02 PM
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AlexR Offline
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RE: Electrical Diverter
(12-01-2009 02:02 PM)martinruf Wrote:  yesterday, we tried to build in the ED in my car.
But it didn't work at all.

On the schema js-svgRender you will see, that the positive is always here. The flow-control will make the car-computer from the negative. We hooked the ED on the negative before the injectors.
"From the computer" is from the negativ.
"To the injectors" goes to the injectors and from there to the positive.

The R10 resistors aren't enough to cut the signal, so we think.

The schema for the ED is only a short time here. But to help us you have to see it.
Any ideas to help us? What we have to change?

Martin,

I had a similar problem when first trying the ED. Turns out I did not have enough resistance in R10 as you are guessing. I bought a variable resistor that had a decent wattage rating and adjusted it until my fuel injectors shut down. I read the resistance of this resistor with my ohm meter. I ordered resistors that had the same resistance and used them.

I did not use the rest of the ED circuit, I only used it for fuel deceleration shut off.

Alex

Cool Flame, LLC
http://www.cool-flame.com
12-02-2009 01:53 PM
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martinruf Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Electrical Diverter
(12-01-2009 02:02 PM)martinruf Wrote:  The flow-control will make the car-computer from the negative. We hooked the ED on the negative before the injectors.
"From the computer" is from the negative.
"To the injectors" goes to the injectors and from there to the positive.

Now the ED worked (a short time). Problem was: we hooked the wrong way.
"From the computer" must be positive, here after the injectors.
"To the injectors" must be the negative side, here to the computer

(12-01-2009 02:02 PM)martinruf Wrote:  The R10 resistors aren't enough to cut the signal, so we think.

We had to double the R10 from 10 to 20.

Problem:
We killed already a Mosfet while the first test-driving (1 hour).
Do I change something or is it only one bad Mosfet?

Greeting from Switzerland
Martin

Ford C-Max 1.8i flexfuel (petrol)
Victor-Tupperware-Cell
4x 5N at 1-2AMP
20% less Liter/100km
12-14-2009 09:52 PM
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AlexR Offline
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RE: Electrical Diverter
(12-14-2009 09:52 PM)martinruf Wrote:  
(12-01-2009 02:02 PM)martinruf Wrote:  The flow-control will make the car-computer from the negative. We hooked the ED on the negative before the injectors.
"From the computer" is from the negative.
"To the injectors" goes to the injectors and from there to the positive.

Now the ED worked (a short time). Problem was: we hooked the wrong way.
"From the computer" must be positive, here after the injectors.
"To the injectors" must be the negative side, here to the computer

(12-01-2009 02:02 PM)martinruf Wrote:  The R10 resistors aren't enough to cut the signal, so we think.

We had to double the R10 from 10 to 20.

Problem:
We killed already a Mosfet while the first test-driving (1 hour).
Do I change something or is it only one bad Mosfet?

The easy part about the polarity of the hook-up is that it only goes one of two ways.

I'd just change the MOSFET and see what happens. They are very static sensitive.

Were you able to shut down the injectors?

Alex

Cool Flame, LLC
http://www.cool-flame.com
12-15-2009 05:50 PM
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martinruf Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Electrical Diverter
(12-15-2009 05:50 PM)AlexR Wrote:  
(12-14-2009 09:52 PM)martinruf Wrote:  We had to double the R10 from 10 to 20 Ohm.
Were you able to shut down the injectors?
At idle, the R10 close significantly. However, on the highway it is sufficient only for stammers, so do not completely closed.
Which setting do you have with the R10?

On what criteria do I determine the setting of the R2 (oxygen sensor)?

Ford C-Max 1.8i flexfuel (petrol)
Victor-Tupperware-Cell
4x 5N at 1-2AMP
20% less Liter/100km
12-19-2009 03:05 PM
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AlexR Offline
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RE: Electrical Diverter
(12-19-2009 03:05 PM)martinruf Wrote:  
(12-15-2009 05:50 PM)AlexR Wrote:  
(12-14-2009 09:52 PM)martinruf Wrote:  We had to double the R10 from 10 to 20 Ohm.
Were you able to shut down the injectors?
At idle, the R10 close significantly. However, on the highway it is sufficient only for stammers, so do not completely closed.
Which setting do you have with the R10?

On what criteria do I determine the setting of the R2 (oxygen sensor)?

Martin,

The R10 should be big enough to shut down your injectors. I'm not sure what you mean by "stammers" but I guess you mean something like "stumbling".

You may need more resistance for R10. I'd make your circuit easy first, take the electronic circuit out of the loop first. Don't physically remove it, just bypass it for now. Just hook up the signal going to the MOSFETs first. I don't have the circuit in front of me, but I believe the switch at the top of the schematic does this. If applying a signal to this will shut of the injectors while driving, then you have the proper resistance.

Be aware also that one wire from the computer may signal more than one injector. On my VW the computer controls all four injectors at the same time. My Ford has a V-8, it fires four injectors at a time.

Alex

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http://www.cool-flame.com
12-19-2009 07:30 PM
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