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Good Results
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bandit354 Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Good Results
How is it going with the rain water have not tried that yet I've just been using distilled water and I keep getting some iron build up in the bottom of the generator. I heard that using filtered rain water has a cleaner by-product then the distilled water.
04-08-2008 01:52 PM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Good Results
KOH was boiling over and into my engine so changed to vinegar, which does nothing, even after draining and refilling with 100% vinegar. I get more fizz out of day old coke. Maybe I should drain and refill it (again) to eliminate any possibility of KOH contamination.

Rick

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04-08-2008 02:01 PM
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Rags Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Good Results
The rain water seems to work fine for me, I have a 2 ss wall switch cell I use just to try different electrolytes. I didn't even filter the rain water and it seems to work as well as distilled. I think the big difference is in what ss you use, and being sure that your leads are ss also and not copper, brass, or aluminum. Anything that is not stainless steel seems to produce more sediment.

Is KOH, lye, or does lye have a different chemical letters. I am not versed in chemistry. Any way I bouth some lye at the grocery store and mixed 1/2 tsp to a gallon of water and put it in the test tube (no pun intended). Hooked up the battery charger and generator, and the needle jumped to 14 amps right off the gitgo.

I dumped that and then re-filled the gallon jug up with clear water with what was left of the first mixture. Fill the pipe and plugged it in again. The amps dropped down to 11 amps. I had a tube in a bubbler, and the bubbles were comming so fast I couldn't keep count, and that was with just the two switch plates. My pipe holds about 64 oz of liquid.

I refilled the jug with water again, and re-filled the generator, plugged it in and the amps went down to 5 amps. So for about 1/8 of a tsp of lye I was pulling 5 amps of power. I added just a pinch, and got to about 8 amps. Filled my generator that is mounted in the car and filled it up. Started the car and my amp gauge was reading between 8 and 9 amps.
Rags
(This post was last modified: 04-08-2008 04:29 PM by Rags.)
04-08-2008 04:27 PM
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bandit354 Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Good Results
I have been buying the cheap distilled water, because I keep getting sediment in the bottom of my generator. I'm not sure about the nuts and bolts in the generator bought at Ace Hardware supposed to be stainless, but the cell I'm using is two negative plates on the ends three neutral plates and one positive plate in the center they are 316 gauge stainless that I cut and I cut strips of stainless to go to the post on the top of the generator so I would not have any copper at all in the cell just all stainless. I still get a little film of what I think is iron on everything, it is a red-orange color.
04-08-2008 05:46 PM
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Rags Offline
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Post: #15
RE: Good Results
If it is red-orange, I have to believe there is some iron in the system somewhere. I was looking online about rain water vs distilled, and from what I read rain water is distilled water, it is just a matter of how it is collected. I am sure it has less junk in it than tap water..

My cell has 7 ss wall switch cover plates from Lowes, I put a magnet on them and it wouldn't stick so I thought they would be ok. I was getting a lot of red-orange stuff, but I knew I had some regular nuts on the ss bolts I was using. So I changed them out for ss nuts and it is a lot better. I think maybe the electrolyte may have something to do with it too. My cell is -,+,-,+ all the way thru. I don't know if there is any benefit to putting them in other configurations or not. I might take mine apart and put the odd one as a neutral in the middle and see what happends. Have you read anything on how to configure them for the best results?

The distilled water I was buying waw 85 cents for a gallon, and it didn't seem to work much better than the water out of my tap.
Rags
04-08-2008 05:57 PM
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bandit354 Offline
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Post: #16
RE: Good Results
I heard that parallel plate designs cause the electrolyte to get hotter faster and could also make it steam causing the water level to drop faster and it was less efficient then the series plate design. My design that I have been trying as of now is - l l + l l -. I am also going to see if I can find some measuring cups made out of 316 stainless steel, I heard they work great in the generator for making hho, and people can get them for next to nothing at resale stores.
04-08-2008 06:21 PM
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Rags Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Good Results
I had not heard or read about that being the case with the plates, interesting, so if I understand right your cell does not alternate the + and -, but are next to each other with a neutral between two sets? Your cell has 22 plates total? I am lucky to get 7 plates to fit in my pipe, let alone 22. I will have to pull my cell out and re-configure it. Well according to the weather forcast it looks like rain here for the next 4 days, my chance to collect more water. LOL
Thanks
Rags
(This post was last modified: 04-09-2008 06:16 AM by Rags.)
04-09-2008 06:14 AM
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Post: #18
RE: Good Results
Bandit
After reading your post, I went out and took my cell out of the pipe and re-configured it. I put it (3) +, (neutral), (3) -, with rubber insulator between them on the neutral plate. Some interesting results.

After trying several mixture I finally ended up with 2 1/2 tsp lye, and 2 1/2 tsp soda in 1 gallon of rain water. I started with 1/4 tsp of each. With the last mixture the amp only got to 5. It was bubbling real good and the bubbles were larger than when I was using just soda. I don't quite understand that. My generator holds 64 oz of electrolyte mixture.
Rags


Later I put together the two plates I had left and put them in same mixture and the needle on the charger pegged past 15 amps. I ended up putting in 1/4 tsp of each and that gave me a reading of 7 amps.

There must be something about having all the + on one side and all the - on the other with a neutral in the middle. It sure took a lot more electrolyte to bring the amps up. I took the car out after putting the generator back together, and the car felt and sounded different that before. It seemed quieter, and a little more power, or it was just my imagination.
04-09-2008 11:14 AM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #19
RE: Good Results
When you have plates in parallel, they have 12 volts across all of them, creating a lot of heat and wasted energy.

Three or 4 cells in series will drop the voltage across them, making them more efficient (in theory).

Rick

Links: Documents / Tuning for Mileage | Toyota Sensors | Autoshop Sensor Tutorials
04-09-2008 11:56 AM
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Rags Offline
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Post: #20
RE: Good Results
It must do something, because I was suprised at how much lye and soda I had to use to get to 5 amps, which is great because your are right it runs cooler.
Rags
04-09-2008 01:34 PM
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