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Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
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rwr Offline
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Post: #1
Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
I have been studying up on HHO production methods for a few years and have produced several different functional HHO configurations that worked in a test bed environment ( my test bench, not on a car yet!). I realize that in order to get the maximum benefit, you must stop your ECU from noticing the extra oxygen in the exhaust so it doesn't richen the fuel mixture and negate the benefits of HHO usage.

If my chemistry serves me correctly, the positive plates/electrodes in an HHO generator release hydrogen and the negative plates/electrodes release the oxygen. My thought is that if you can build an HHO generator that allows you to segregate and reduce or eliminate the oxygen from the hydrogen, then you would not have to tinker with the O2 sensor voltages using an EFIE or similar devices?

Does this sound feasible? I have a few ideas on the physical configuration of a segregated HHO generator, but before I spend any more of my time & money, I would like some feed back on the idea.

Thanks in advance!

RWR Newb to Forum, but not HHO generation
05-28-2008 06:50 AM
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Fatman1 Offline
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RE: Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
I think when you run HHO u are burning alot more of the unsed gas and the o2 see's it as you are running lean and dumps more fuel, thats why you get more power but not alot in gas saving just running gas inriched with HHO. But that just the way I see it. If i rember right o2 sensor should be called something else
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05-28-2008 04:01 PM
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odieub Offline
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RE: Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
from the link mike sent me the other day the neg plates produce the hydrogen and so forth. i was curious about building a cell with several neg plate and one pos. for my diesel pickup so i could get maximum hydrogen but no one has commented on this.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/Hba...ctrol.html

if this link works this is what he sent me.
05-28-2008 05:45 PM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
Having a lot of neg plates isn't going to have the effect you'd like. Current will still flow the path of least resistance. My guess is you'd have a lot of plates without much gas activity.

Rick

Links: Documents / Tuning for Mileage | Toyota Sensors | Autoshop Sensor Tutorials
(This post was last modified: 05-28-2008 06:33 PM by colchiro.)
05-28-2008 06:32 PM
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rwr Offline
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RE: Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
Thanks for the information, and as you guessed it, my chemistry did not serve me correctly at all, I got the whole thing reversed. But, I have been putting together a double stack of SS plates and have them more or less physically separated, but are sharing the same electrolyte below the gas production line sort of. One stack of plates connects to the positive power lead and the other to the negative. There is an outlet tube on both sides of the HHO generator, one lets the H2 out and the other lets out the O2 (theoretically!) I have yet to test it on my bench, and am trying to figure out to verify if I have really split the gasses. Anyone know of a method of identifying what gas is what? I will be scouring the net to see what I can find and will post photos and results as soon as I have some to show, good or bad! Thanks again, all of you....
05-30-2008 03:15 AM
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Gomelesose Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
rwr Wrote:trying to figure out to verify if I have really split the gasses. Anyone know of a method of identifying what gas is what?

You need 3 things for a flame: Fuel source(hydrogen in this case), oxygen, heat.

If you truly are getting a seperation, you should be able to ignite the output of one of your collection containers (hydrogen) and not the other. This is because only one of the containers you are collecting the gases in would be collecting oxygen which will not ignite unless it has a fuel to burn also.

Stephen
05-30-2008 05:48 AM
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qsiguy Offline
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RE: Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
What you are doing is exactly right. I read a while back about a Russian device they use on space craft that generates O2 from water for their breathing air. The hydrogen gets vented out to space or maybe used for something else. The device was as you described with separate chambers and two outlets, one for O2 and one for hydrogen.

As far as this changing the O2 reading I don't thing so. The water as twice as much hydrogen as oxygen when separated and compared to the total volume of air entering the engine I think that level is insignificant. I agree with Fatman in that the extra O2 content in the exhaust is mostly from the enhanced combustion of the gasoline which is our primary goal with this amount of HHO.

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(This post was last modified: 05-30-2008 11:32 AM by qsiguy.)
05-30-2008 11:25 AM
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colchiro Offline
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RE: Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
I read (here I think) that they separate out the o2 from water in submarines too.

If I want something to burn better than in the air, I'd add some o2 to it. That's why you aren't allowed to smoke around o2, b/c it burns too good. Hmm

I don't see any reason to separate the gasses, other than maybe to keep them from recombining for a few seconds.

Rick

Links: Documents / Tuning for Mileage | Toyota Sensors | Autoshop Sensor Tutorials
05-30-2008 12:01 PM
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Fatman1 Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
as we know the pos is o2 and neg is hyd so it works like so( see atached)


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(This post was last modified: 05-31-2008 03:43 PM by Fatman1.)
05-30-2008 04:44 PM
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mjmpickering Offline
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RE: Has anyone thought of this? and/or tried this?
You can also separate the hydrogen and oxygen by using electromagnets. In the chapter 10 doc in the files section, this is shown. Its a very straight forward design.
05-31-2008 06:40 AM
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