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How to adjust a PWM
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a3holerman Offline
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Post: #1
How to adjust a PWM
Hi,
New here. Just bought a HHo generator on ebay. Have done a ton of research and just wanted to get started. I Plan to build my own a bit later on but for now this will get me going. Have read that a PWM is a very good additional tool to use. I understand it can reduce the wattage used by the unit for the same amount of gas production. How does one set up the parameters for a given generator? I assume you could, on a test bench, adjust it for max gas flow but is this the proper way?

Thanks

Tom
05-26-2008 05:26 AM
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CitatioN10 Offline
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Post: #2
RE: How to adjust a PWM
I was also just wondering about a PWM , I was reading about it and it seems you can take 12 volts and crank it up to 30 volts ? I just made a 12 cell tonight and was doing some testing with my 12v 10amp battery charger, doing about 5 amps .. was working ok ..

Then I was looking around the garage and got to thinking .. what If I put this 18Volt dewalt battery on it ! Well I did that the output DOUBLED ! I was running 18V @ 7.6 amps

Now if this is what the PWM can do ? give more voltage ?

Then I would say this is something everyone would gain from .
05-30-2008 05:57 PM
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CitatioN10 Offline
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RE: How to adjust a PWM
I was wrong on the PWM idea, you can NOT increase your voltage , just increase amps and just the pulse width alone is supposed to help a lot .
06-15-2008 07:50 PM
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qsiguy Offline
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RE: How to adjust a PWM
PWM just modulates the DC output voltage. Basically turns it on/off very rapidly. The voltage OUT is the same as the voltage IN. It only allows you to turn down the amperage. With the PWM turned all the way up you will get close to the amperage you'd have without it, tho it will still reduce the amps a bit. It does not maintain the same output at less "wattage", it's just to control the amperage especially in an inefficient cell design that wants to heat up rapidly which will cause the amps to rapidly rise as well. Some claim they have altered the frequency that the PWM runs at and achieved greater gas production but that remains to be proven to the masses.

The primary use for a PWM is as a DC motor speed controller.

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(This post was last modified: 06-15-2008 07:58 PM by qsiguy.)
06-15-2008 07:56 PM
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ptours99 Offline
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RE: How to adjust a PWM
you can also adjust the duty cycle say to 50% and that will give you same output at less amps.gen will run cooler.

selling an enclosure for the rear of cab semi truck 28''X20''X6'' CUSTOM MADE ALUMINUM TO HOUSE HHO GENERATORS AND INCLUDING A RESERVOIR BUBBLER AND REGULAR BUBBLR ptoures@sbcglobal.net usa only
06-16-2008 04:43 PM
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skiers4ever Offline
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Post: #6
RE: How to adjust a PWM
ptours99 Wrote:you can also adjust the duty cycle say to 50% and that will give you same output at less amps.gen will run cooler.

How do you do that ptours99? On my Ridgeline, I've noticed that I get really good mileage increase with NaOH and Distilled Water (1/8 teaspoon to 64 ounces) as long as the AMPS stay around 8 to 10. Once it goes above 10, I'm finding I'm not getting an increase in MPG, I actually get less MPG than without the gen. My amps start out at about 6 cold, and after about an hour and a half of running, it goes to 12 amps. Once it gets that high, I think I'm producing too much HHO and my MPG drops. I would love to regulate my Gen so that it doesn't get above 10 amps or gets too hot. Any ideas? I could lower the NaOH to 1/16 of a teaspoon, but that's almost nothing. Thanks, John

2007 Honda Ridgeline 3.5L 4WD
Hydro Super 2 installed on 5/21/08
Colorado - 10,000 Feet!
06-16-2008 05:47 PM
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a3holerman Offline
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RE: How to adjust a PWM
John do you have an EIFI installed? If not that could be the reason your milage decreases with an increase in HHO production.

Tom
06-16-2008 11:30 PM
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qsiguy Offline
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RE: How to adjust a PWM
I don't believe too much HHO is causing your decrease in mileage. The higher amps is increasing the constant load on the motor which can have a major effect on efficiency. Definitely use an EFIE if you aren't already.

ptours99, I disagree. A typical PWM will just lower the amps and output at the same time. It is just a simple method of controlling the amps. If you adjust for 50% duty cycle you get 50% of the output. HHO production is a product of amperage. Obviously there are many factors that determine efficiency but it's the amps that make the gas.

John, a PWM is a simple short term method for controlling amps. Drawbacks to the PWM are that you have to constantly monitor it and adjust (unless you build one that monitors amps automatically), and that you are still wasting power through heat in the PWM. I say short term because if amperage run off is a problem a more efficient generator is really the fix. An efficient design should top out amperage and temperature at a point and stabilize. Another short term trick is to wire your generator in series with your head lights. This depends on your generator configuration. If you have cells already in series this is not an option as the voltage available to your headlights will be too low unless you just run it that way during the day and have a bypass for at night. Wired in series with your headlights (or any ~10amp load) will keep your generator running at a set amperage all day long regardless of the electrolyte concentration.

I found a link to a PWM that sensed current and automatically adjusted. I haven't verified it yet but it looked like a cool idea. If I can find it I'll post it. I'm getting too many files and favorites on multiple computers, can't keep track of all the info!

EDIT: Found it here. http://zerofossilfuel.googlepages.com/pwm.html

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(This post was last modified: 06-17-2008 08:11 AM by qsiguy.)
06-17-2008 08:07 AM
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skiers4ever Offline
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Post: #9
RE: How to adjust a PWM
a3holerman Wrote:John do you have an EIFI installed? If not that could be the reason your milage decreases with an increase in HHO production.

Tom

Hi Tom, No EFIE yet...I'm wanting one but can't figure out what I need. Hopefully someone will know here and reply to my post for help. Thanks! John

2007 Honda Ridgeline 3.5L 4WD
Hydro Super 2 installed on 5/21/08
Colorado - 10,000 Feet!
06-17-2008 06:10 PM
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skiers4ever Offline
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Post: #10
RE: How to adjust a PWM
qsiguy Wrote:I don't believe too much HHO is causing your decrease in mileage. The higher amps is increasing the constant load on the motor which can have a major effect on efficiency. Definitely use an EFIE if you aren't already.

ptours99, I disagree. A typical PWM will just lower the amps and output at the same time. It is just a simple method of controlling the amps. If you adjust for 50% duty cycle you get 50% of the output. HHO production is a product of amperage. Obviously there are many factors that determine efficiency but it's the amps that make the gas.

John, a PWM is a simple short term method for controlling amps. Drawbacks to the PWM are that you have to constantly monitor it and adjust (unless you build one that monitors amps automatically), and that you are still wasting power through heat in the PWM. I say short term because if amperage run off is a problem a more efficient generator is really the fix. An efficient design should top out amperage and temperature at a point and stabilize. Another short term trick is to wire your generator in series with your head lights. This depends on your generator configuration. If you have cells already in series this is not an option as the voltage available to your headlights will be too low unless you just run it that way during the day and have a bypass for at night. Wired in series with your headlights (or any ~10amp load) will keep your generator running at a set amperage all day long regardless of the electrolyte concentration.

I found a link to a PWM that sensed current and automatically adjusted. I haven't verified it yet but it looked like a cool idea. If I can find it I'll post it. I'm getting too many files and favorites on multiple computers, can't keep track of all the info!

EDIT: Found it here. http://zerofossilfuel.googlepages.com/pwm.html

Thanks gsiguy. I want to install an EFIE but I don't know how to read my schematics so don't know if I need a Single or Dual or even if an EFIE is needed. From the schematics, I have 2 HO2S in the engine compartment, front secondary on the left side of engine compartment and rear secondary also on the left side of engine compartment. Should I try an extender? If so, do I need two? Or, if only one, which one needs it? Thanks for the link. I'll check it out. If you know how to read schematics and would be willing to take a look, I'll send them to you. I would appreciate any help. John

2007 Honda Ridgeline 3.5L 4WD
Hydro Super 2 installed on 5/21/08
Colorado - 10,000 Feet!
06-17-2008 06:18 PM
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