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My H2 Generator Plans
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Gary Offline
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Post: #21
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
Actually, that's exactly what I am going to do first: 3 and 3 in parallell. Then will try 3 sets of 2 as well. With all the bolts from the tubes, it's just a matter of hassling with cutting and bending some Romex to fit the jumps. I've gone and drilled more holes to create some current; hoping now it won't mix the gasses. The plexi will allow me to see this, and I can do the fire test later. If there's a small amount of o2 getting in, I'm not going to wet myself over it.
There are small drillways across the very top of the cell walls between each other. Also, I don't glue the tops of the cell dividers between each other. Since production is accumulative, I deemed a 3/32" to be quite large enough. There are drillways at the bottom of one bank of cells for fill flow. It fills quite slowly, but I don't want current leaks skewing my results. Gas has to travel to the center cells to exhaust. I always put exhausts in the center since my experience with the long series cell spitting into the tube when braking. The center always stays low.
09-20-2008 07:00 PM
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jjb2888 Offline
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Post: #22
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
Gary Wrote:Actually, that's exactly what I am going to do first: 3 and 3 in parallell. Then will try 3 sets of 2 as well. With all the bolts from the tubes, it's just a matter of hassling with cutting and bending some Romex to fit the jumps. I've gone and drilled more holes to create some current; hoping now it won't mix the gasses. The plexi will allow me to see this, and I can do the fire test later. If there's a small amount of o2 getting in, I'm not going to wet myself over it.
There are small drillways across the very top of the cell walls between each other. Also, I don't glue the tops of the cell dividers between each other. Since production is accumulative, I deemed a 3/32" to be quite large enough. There are drillways at the bottom of one bank of cells for fill flow. It fills quite slowly, but I don't want current leaks skewing my results. Gas has to travel to the center cells to exhaust. I always put exhausts in the center since my experience with the long series cell spitting into the tube when braking. The center always stays low.

Good idea for the exhaust. The cell dividers act as baffles so the center will slosh less. Good thinking.
09-21-2008 07:44 AM
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Gary Offline
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Post: #23
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
I drilled out the center separator in each cell, from a couple 3/8" holes on either side of the tubes, followed by 5/16", 1/4", 1/8", 1/8" where I had just a row of 1/16" holes up the middle. Production very slightly increased; seems to work on 3 cells or less. I have to put a new ammeter in the car before I can tell what's going on. 6 is a bust with tubes.
No need for me to test the wiring setups without an ammeter, so maybe tomorrow.
09-21-2008 12:58 PM
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texasdanml430 Offline
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Post: #24
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
what are you using for electrolyte in the 6 series cell?
09-23-2008 02:00 PM
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Gary Offline
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Post: #25
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
A high concentration of NaOH. Oddly, the setup with the four negs worked much better, except for being a high-amp water heater.
I think the problem here is tubes. Barry's units go from 6-9 amps (I think the new model is 6), so I theorize that plates are better from this. My four-tuber did 19.
The series seems to do nothing for some reason.
09-23-2008 03:32 PM
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TimThe Scooper Offline
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Post: #26
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
Gary Wrote:A high concentration of NaOH. Oddly, the setup with the four negs worked much better, except for being a high-amp water heater.
I think the problem here is tubes. Barry's units go from 6-9 amps (I think the new model is 6), so I theorize that plates are better from this. My four-tuber did 19.
The series seems to do nothing for some reason.

Just a thought as I still wait for my KOH. (been 2 months now) I am using two 1/8 inch pieces of Lexan with medium density fiberglass between them as a separator. (with large openings in the Lexan, of course) This way I can keep the tubes about 5 mm apart and keep the spacing even. One more thing you might want to consider... insulating the top inch or inch and a half of each tube (the part out of the electrolyte) with shrink wrap to keep stray currents contained (thus reducing heat). I hope to post some pics as soon as I learn how, as my design is slightly different. Hopefully it will give and/or get some other ideas!
09-24-2008 12:46 AM
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Gary Offline
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Post: #27
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
Now there's a thought. I'll add to it, since we're talking about tube units here (and/or rods or anything that is not plates)
I had considered and posted a query about the top parts of the tubes: I thought that the water film sloshing up and down on the top part would be more susceptible to heating and perhaps most of the heat was coming from that.
You insulation idea may have good merit; the water level would have to be kept up for efficiency though. I guess the tool dip would be the ticket here.
Now you've done what I was thinking of, except for this: if you have round holes in the lexan, the tops of the holes could collect gasses on the underside of the plastic and some could go through the filter. If the holes were pointed at the top (with a file), there would be no horizontal planes for the bubbles to collect on. They would be shaped like a teardrop. I also thought of simply cutting four squares out of the plastic and the center bars would hold the filter in place, but you could also melt some SS wire large enough to be stiff into the plastic to act as retaining bars.
A square frame of the lexan with the filter glued to it (weld-on #16) could be spot-glued to the divider also, trapping the filter against the divider, but I don't like the idea of it being off-sided, so the cutouts in the divider would have to be large enough for the filter medium to fit inside of, yet have some lip around the circumference to attach the filter frame to. I would NOT use weld-on here; it is very permanent.
Someone did a tube and rod arrangement with filter medium wrapped around the rod. That would seem to me to be effective for less amps and heat, if you could get the spacing tight enough; I'm not totally sure what's happening with the flow of current with two tubes next to each other. It appears that they make bubbles all around the circumference, but there always seems to be the heat issue as well. That makes me think that the tubes are being charged, but not merely across the closest point: it could be traveling through the electrolyte at large, heating the molecules.
People keep asking if the inside of the tubes make gas. Very little. I think those bubbles were formed at the bottoms. All charge in the electrolyte inside of the tubes is probably negative, giving no reason for the water to split.


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(This post was last modified: 09-24-2008 03:01 AM by Gary.)
09-24-2008 02:57 AM
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howiemandel Offline
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Post: #28
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
Maybe..... alot of the current spins off from all those ridges on the tubes? Keep in mind I build one of these suckers as well, and mine enjoyed heat as well. But im just trying to be simple here. Im just wondering it all those big ridges are creating the heat, creating resistance themselves. I guess if you have smooth pipe you could copy the design and see if this is the case. I know this. THe threaded rod, doesnt get as hot. Although they have ridges, they are much, much more fine/small. So... the resistance might not be as noticable to the current.??? Just thinking out loud.
09-24-2008 03:21 AM
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Gary Offline
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Post: #29
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
I don't know. The ridges represent more area, and the electrolytic action here is working on a molecular level, so I sort of doubt it's the cause of heat - more like the tubes are too large? I've wondered what would happen if they were shorter.
I had randomly picked a 6-1/2" length...to match Barry's approximately so we could compare numbers in order to postulate some formulas. But that can't happen if it doesn't work.
Keep in mind, the 5 tuber was one pos in a center box with four negs surrounding it, and the series unit was 6 cells of two each in separate baths. The oddest thing is that it didn't work well when cut down to just one cell. I dont' get that, unless my electrolyte is TOO hot for it but not too hot for my dry cell, where it's putting out 1L/min. of HHO. I'll weaken it this week and test again.
09-24-2008 06:32 PM
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TimThe Scooper Offline
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Post: #30
RE: My H2 Generator Plans
Gary Wrote:I don't know. The ridges represent more area, and the electrolytic action here is working on a molecular level, so I sort of doubt it's the cause of heat - more like the tubes are too large? I've wondered what would happen if they were shorter.
I had randomly picked a 6-1/2" length...to match Barry's approximately so we could compare numbers in order to postulate some formulas. But that can't happen if it doesn't work.
Keep in mind, the 5 tuber was one pos in a center box with four negs surrounding it, and the series unit was 6 cells of two each in separate baths. The oddest thing is that it didn't work well when cut down to just one cell. I dont' get that, unless my electrolyte is TOO hot for it but not too hot for my dry cell, where it's putting out 1L/min. of HHO. I'll weaken it this week and test again.
I am using SS 316 round tubing for my set up. Also, they are cut shorter to provide 20 square inch of surface area per cell, thus 10 amps @.5 amps per si. I hope I got that right, I don't have my notes with me at the moment. Also, I tried drilling the holes at a downward angle from each side to form a "V" and it really wasn't that difficult. The tubes I am using also produces hydroxy at a pretty good clip. No way of measuring it yet as I'm checking it in an open bath. When I insert the divider the production reduces by about half, but the gasses are dividing. That is without the fiberglass separator. Still experimenting and still waiting for glue and KOH...
09-24-2008 10:49 PM
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