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PEM Cells.
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Zipstor Offline
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Post: #1
PEM Cells.
[Image: 200w.JPG]

Has anyone installed a PEM cell so far? I remind you that they work both ways.

2H + O ---> H2O + Electricity
or
H2O+Electricity ---> H2 + O

http://www.horizonfuelcell.com/store/h200.htm

>> http://brownsgas.com
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2009 05:36 PM by Zipstor.)
01-23-2009 05:28 PM
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thomasbala Offline
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Post: #2
RE: PEM Cells.
(01-23-2009 05:28 PM)Zipstor Wrote:  [Image: 200w.JPG]

Has anyone installed a PEM cell so far? I remind you that they work both ways.

2H + O ---> H2O + Electricity
or
H2O+Electricity ---> H2 + O

http://www.horizonfuelcell.com/store/h200.htm
I've looked and looked on their site and can't find a straight answer to How many lpm HHO for how many dollars, or, how many Watts [constant flow DC] per ??? What is PEM? Looks and sounds like pure 100%, unadulterated BS to me; but I'm always open to correction. Correct me please!
(01-23-2009 05:28 PM)Zipstor Wrote:  [Image: 200w.JPG]

Has anyone installed a PEM cell so far? I remind you that they work both ways.

2H + O ---> H2O + Electricity
or
H2O+Electricity ---> H2 + O

http://www.horizonfuelcell.com/store/h200.htm
I've looked and looked on their site and can't find a straight answer to How many lpm HHO for how many dollars, or, how many Watts [constant flow DC] per ??? What is PEM? Looks and sounds like pure 100%, unadulterated BS to me; but I'm always open to correction. Correct me please!
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2009 06:13 PM by thomasbala.)
01-23-2009 06:12 PM
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Zipstor Offline
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Post: #3
RE: PEM Cells.
Flow rate at rated output..................................2.6 l/min

That's in the specs.

>> http://brownsgas.com
01-23-2009 06:50 PM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #4
RE: PEM Cells.
I don't see a need for converting hho back to electricity, where you going to get it?

I'm not saying it isn't cool, just not needed for our stuff.

I'd rather have a cell optimized for making hho, not a cell that's pretty good at making hho and can also convert it back.

Rick

Links: Documents / Tuning for Mileage | Toyota Sensors | Autoshop Sensor Tutorials
01-23-2009 06:54 PM
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Zipstor Offline
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Post: #5
RE: PEM Cells.
PEM cells works both ways Rick! That's my point here.

This thread is DEFINITELY about making HHO with a PEM cell.

Input: Water+Electricity
Output: HHO!

>> http://brownsgas.com
01-23-2009 06:57 PM
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thomasbala Offline
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Post: #6
RE: PEM Cells.
(01-23-2009 06:50 PM)Zipstor Wrote:  Flow rate at rated output..................................2.6 l/min

That's in the specs.
Please forgive me if I sound ignorant or arrogant; it's been a hard work week [didn't make squat] and the wife's gone off to bingo without leaving me a meal; I'll be at Micky D's shortly. But, How much for the 2.6 lpm cell; what are the specs, volts, amps, MMW, etc. What kind of membrane is used to convert H2 plus O2 to Watts. How many Watts? Amps? Volts? I think, once again, you've been taken in. The site is 100% pure, unadulterated BS. Prove me wrong!
01-23-2009 07:49 PM
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benny Offline
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Post: #7
RE: PEM Cells.
If you read the specs, and the description, for this unit, you will see that it is a fuel cell.

It is designed to output 24V at 8.4A, ~200W, and CONSUMES 3lpm of H2.
It works in one direction only.
It is NOT a hydroxy, or H2, or HHO generator in any form or fashion.


I'm afraid you got this one backwards, Zipstor.
Should do a little more research before posting 'what do you think of this' type posts.
01-24-2009 02:18 AM
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Zipstor Offline
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Post: #8
RE: PEM Cells.
Tom: This concept is called Proton Exchange Membrane, here you will find how they work: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PEM_fuel_cell
They are more expensive than the electrolysers at this stage, it's high tech stuff. However the price will shrink through time, as the industry will have to make more when the market will grow.

Benny: These cells DOES work both ways. I appear to have a small kit at home and it DOES output H2 and O if you input electricity and water. http://www.horizonfuelcell.com/store/h_racer20.htm

>> http://brownsgas.com
(This post was last modified: 01-24-2009 03:05 AM by Zipstor.)
01-24-2009 02:33 AM
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gtkco Offline
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Post: #9
RE: PEM Cells.
Yes, the process of proton membrane exchange is bi-directional. But the linked product is specificly intended to go in one direction so doing the reverse might not be practical just from a usage point of view. Regardless, even if it is designed to go in both directions, it is ridiculously expensive. Since this link has no price attached, see the link below for a comparison. Assuming that the reverse will produce the exact amount of H2 it uses to consume for producing electricity, the unit below will need 25 amps from your alt to produce 3.6 LPM all for a mere $6,500. It's going to be a loooooong time before that becomes cost effective!

http://www.fuelcellstore.com/en/pc/viewP...roduct=352
(This post was last modified: 01-24-2009 10:44 AM by gtkco.)
01-24-2009 10:43 AM
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Gary Offline
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Post: #10
RE: PEM Cells.
If I had 3L/min. HHO available, I sure as heck wouldn't be using it to produce a few watts of electricity!
OTOH, if your 16yr. old son bought one for HHO and drove it on his car until he was around 65 yrs. old, he might pay it off.
Well, you ASKED what we thought... :-)
01-24-2009 04:04 PM
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