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Possible vapor lock?
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alscrimp Offline
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Post: #1
Possible vapor lock?
I first want to address everyone who has helped me in the past, THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!! Because of you I'm ready to trash my SS plate wet cell and build a dry cell. Now all the engineers out there I have 2 questions that have been eating at me. Like many of you out there I started with the Water4Gas setup. As you know with this setup you have a bubbler built into the cap. Being that you hookup your outlet to manifold vacuum (as stated by the w4g instructions) you open the bubbler a small amount to facilitate a fresh air induction to the electrolyte. This in effect causes a bubbling action in the mixture and would also allow a small amount air to be introduced into the top of the cap. It would also allow a very small amount of heat that was generated by the electrolysis of the chemical reaction to dissipate through this.

Now my first question, now that most people have changed to the dry cell setup, which is a CLOSED system (see where this is going), is there a chance of some type of vapor lock happening by the HHO gas constantly being outputted? There is no fresh air being introduced anywhere and granted you are suppose to output into the air intake only for this system, right? Maybe I'm thinking too much but to give you an example. A furnace in a home has to have a fresh air intake in almost every room that has an output vent in order for the heat to flow properly. It seems to me that in this system you would have to have something to introduce fresh air to stimulate the mixture. Any thoughts?

Now my second question, Is there anything out there that could facilitate the first question? Let me reiterate, is there anything that would allow the introduction of fresh air into the system WITHOUT letting the HHO gas escape? Also introducing fresh air could help reduce some of the heat generated which, from what I read in the forums, have people utilizing PWM sometimes with unsatifactory results. Any thoughts on this?
11-02-2009 08:43 AM
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mike Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Possible vapor lock?
Re vapor lock: This can never happen. The electrolysis process makes HHO gas out of water. This is a huge increase in volume, and always requires an outlet. It will keep needing an outlet as long as electrolysis is taking place as it will keep producing gas. You can't have a vapor lock as long as new gas is being made.

The furnace example isn't the same thing. A furnace doesn't create air. So it needs new air in or it can't output air. But the dry cell will create the gas it is putting into the engine. So you don't need an inflow of any kind.

Regarding your 2nd question: A properly designed dry cell doesn't run too hot. They run about 100 deg F or so when they are designed properly, and therefore heat isn't an issue.

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11-02-2009 01:19 PM
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alscrimp Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Possible vapor lock?
Hey Mike,

I keep hearing about extra neutral plates being installed. Exactly what does this do? I have a 9 plate setup now and would like to reduce the heat being generated without using a PWM. Would it be worth this effort? Also does it make a difference whether you use a -nnn+nnn- or +nnn-nnn+ setup? Thanks for all your help!
11-03-2009 03:55 AM
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mike Offline
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RE: Possible vapor lock?
There's no difference between the 2 setups. Plus and minus are interchangeable. The circuit works exactly the same either way.

To reduce heat and current you can do one of two things:

1) reduce the amount of electrolyte in your mix.

2) add a neutral plate to each side. This will lower the voltage from plate to plate and cause less current to flow.

You don't want so much current that your cell overheats. You'll just make steam and waste much of the amperage that should be making HHO. Your cell shouldn't run at over 120 degrees, and less would be better.

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11-03-2009 11:36 PM
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alscrimp Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Possible vapor lock?
Thank you for the quick reply. I currently have a 9 plate setup in a Water4Gas one quart glass jar (got tired of the melting towers). Is it safe to allow the electrolyte level to drop below the top of the plates? I know you can do it in the old w4g wire system. I do have the sides and the connections of the "brick" wrapped with vinyl tape.
11-04-2009 03:14 AM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Possible vapor lock?
Dry cells usually need a reservoir (like you use for windshield washer or radiator overflow) to keep it full so they are always full.

Your biggest concern with a half-full cell should be loose connections that could cause a spark. (boom) Parts do loosen with time and heat.

Rick

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(This post was last modified: 11-04-2009 04:58 AM by colchiro.)
11-04-2009 04:51 AM
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alscrimp Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Possible vapor lock?
(11-04-2009 04:51 AM)colchiro Wrote:  Dry cells usually need a reservoir (like you use for windshield washer or radiator overflow) to keep it full so they are always full.

Your biggest concern with a half-full cell should be loose connections that could cause a spark. (boom) Parts do loosen with time and heat.

Thanks for the insight. I will keep an eye on the fluid level as I fill up this vehicle every 2 days (I drive 200 miles everyday) and I always check my fluids at every fillup.
11-04-2009 08:01 AM
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