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Steam Injection
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Gary Offline
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Post: #1
Steam Injection
Just a quick rundown for now: I've begun thinking and searching on steam devices as an alternative to water injection or humitidy injection, as with the evaporative cannisters.
As yet I see some problems right away. One is the assumption made (elsewhere) that the heat of steam won't allow the massive expansion of water in the combustion cycle. I don't think that myself: a hundred degrees F. is not going to be much difference between atmospheric temps and combustion temps.
Next, I came up with the thought of my pressurized steam *(I'm leaning towards a reserve to fulfill open throttle needs) coming through my valves, into a vacuum. It occurs to me that the droplets may expand, making them less atomized, and even may do some condensing back into water while travelling thru the intake plenum.
Thoughts?
12-11-2008 08:25 AM
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cjpeaceful Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Steam Injection
Thoughts on the steam producing device itself? Pictures, drawings, sketches?
12-12-2008 02:18 PM
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Gary Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Steam Injection
Not yet; too busy with the evap tests and h2, and my new torch.
Ideas range a bit. I started with a drip system and a heated pan or tube on the exhaust, went to a wire in a tube in the intake, looked at tubes thru the CAT like a PICC *(you know, the one that doesn't exist yet...) and have come full circle back to where I started.
I see a solenoid, controlling a water valve shutoff. This wires to the ignition.
The water valve is controlled by the throttle position.
The water from the valve goes to the exhaust manifold tube.
The steam tube is plumbed with copper line to the intake behind the filter, where there is a small suction.
The steam tube has an opening with a small filter to allow air to enter so steam can travel to the intake.
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2008 05:01 PM by Gary.)
12-12-2008 04:27 PM
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ghahai ghato Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Steam Injection
JUst a thought Gary;

Hot vapour injection system...?

We wrap a good length of copper tubing tightly & neatly around the exhaust pipe closest to the exhaust manifold, then channel the WIS breather outlet at one end of this pipe where the air is heated... this hot air would heat the WIS vapourizer up thus sending partially steamed water vapour into the intake manifold....
12-12-2008 07:25 PM
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rzone Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Steam Injection
A quick opinion about condensing: this is going to happen anyway, but water condensing in air turn into fog which is best for engine. Droplets may appear if steam touch a colder surface as intake manifold which I don't think is possible if engine is at operating temperature.
12-13-2008 12:14 AM
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Gary Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Steam Injection
I think temps are relative, which is why your room temp water can "steam" when you take it outside in the cold. So it all depends on what temp your surfaces are, water is, and steam is.
Secondly, I don't know yet WHAT is best in an engine, and if you do, please elaborate and/or show links to science behind it.
If I know what is best to use, I can make a device to create it, but at this point I'd have to try each different thing. So adding you guy's ideas to mine, we have this listed progression:
1.) spitting water
2.) spray
3.) mist
4.) atomized mist
5.) fume, or humidity
6.) condensing steam
7.) steam
8.) live steam
9.) hot air
As I see it, IF the principle is one of component splitting, anything from 3 to 8 would work.
IF the principle is expansion, 3 to 7 would work.
IF the principle were compression by noncompression (liquids don't compress) 1 to 4 would work.
12-13-2008 05:17 AM
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rzone Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Steam Injection
All I have read so far is already posted and discussed on the web. My conclusion is based on reports, basic physics and some experiments I done.
I have a few simple conclusions:
Water droplets can be harmful for engine, and they don't work anyway.
This leads to hot steam or mist. I prefer mist because liquid water can absorb a large amount of heat only to change its state from liquid to steam. Producing fine atomized water is another issue. I'm still waiting for my ultrasonic foggers and I didn't figure out an efficient way to deliver it to engine. If they work for me I'll post my report.
12-13-2008 12:27 PM
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maxc Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Steam Injection
Gary Wrote:Just a quick rundown for now: I've begun thinking and searching on steam devices as an alternative to water injection or humitidy injection, as with the evaporative cannisters.
As yet I see some problems right away. One is the assumption made (elsewhere) that the heat of steam won't allow the massive expansion of water in the combustion cycle. I don't think that myself: a hundred degrees F. is not going to be much difference between atmospheric temps and combustion temps.
Next, I came up with the thought of my pressurized steam *(I'm leaning towards a reserve to fulfill open throttle needs) coming through my valves, into a vacuum. It occurs to me that the droplets may expand, making them less atomized, and even may do some condensing back into water while travelling thru the intake plenum.
Thoughts?
Steam works very well if the system is set up right. If you have a carb you can use it too help vaporize the fuel. It will help the over all combustion pressures. It seams that some people think steam stops expanding when water is turned too steam.
You need to buy 100amp mig welder. Copper tube is not the way too go. You don't need high pressure.
I have work on many different systems. All the turbo guys wast the time cooling there intake charge with water. When steam has an almost infinite octane.
12-13-2008 02:07 PM
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Gary Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Steam Injection
Let me get this straight. You're gonna pour water or steam through your carburetter while making your steam with a 100amp welder driving down the road. I want to see your alternator!
12-13-2008 05:13 PM
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rzone Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Steam Injection
I did a google for nebuliser...no specifications or schematics. I think it can be made using a brake fluid reservoir with low level switch and a windshield washer pump for refill but I don't know if nebuliser can pump for long period of time.
12-14-2008 03:44 AM
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