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WHY so many diffrent ways ?
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CitatioN10 Offline
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Post: #1
WHY so many diffrent ways ?
I see so many different ways to situate your cell's .

Why am I confused ? because all we all want is the most Hydrogen volume we can get RIGHT ?

So why do some people with plates as

+-+-+-+-+- OR -NNNNN+NNNNN OR -NNNNNN-NNNNNN+

so many different ways BUT what one is CORRECT ?

Also size of plates ? do we want them long and tall , say 4 inch wide by 6 inch tall ? if we have the room anyway

OH and the X pattern of sanding with 80 grit ...

some solid info would be great , not only for me but for some users on here

Thanks
06-27-2008 09:06 PM
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jksav7 Offline
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Post: #2
RE: WHY so many diffrent ways ?
Good questions. I can answer some of them. As to which configuration is best, there should be enough neutral plates to ideally cut the voltage per cell to around 2 volts. If it's not an isolated-bath series booster that is being built, which means more voltage leakage and less efficiency, then around 3 volts or more per cell will probably work better. The +-+- configuration, which is a parallel design, will heat the electrolyte in short order.

As to the plate size, they can be as big as one has room for. As to their shape, square is good, or better yet is when they're a little wider than they are tall. I got this info right from Bob Boyce. (I know ZFF on youtube says otherwise, but he doesn't have the experience Bob has with hydroxy.)

Sanding the plates is essential to properly condition them for maximum efficiency and longevity. The sanding should be done in an "x" pattern with very course (40 grit, if possible) sandpaper.
06-27-2008 09:19 PM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #3
RE: WHY so many diffrent ways ?
CitatioN10 Wrote:So why do some people with plates as

+-+-+-+-+- OR -NNNNN+NNNNN OR -NNNNNN-NNNNNN+

so many different ways BUT what one is CORRECT ?

I've seen +-+-+-+-+- in a series cell where there was 2 volts on the cell. (2 volts for each +- pair is optimal for a series cell.)

-NNNNN+NNNNN is bogus since the right side would produce no gas. -NNNNN+ would work tho, but +NNNNNN-NNNNNN+ would produce more gas (close to 2x), if you have room for the extra plates. (These are 12 volt setups.)

-NNNNNN-NNNNNN+ is also bogus (since only the right side should produce gas) unless you change the left plate to + so it looks like this: +NNNNNN-NNNNNN+ (These are also 12 volt setups.)

It's all about how much room you have. JK has some good advice.

Rick

Links: Documents / Tuning for Mileage | Toyota Sensors | Autoshop Sensor Tutorials
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2008 09:49 PM by colchiro.)
06-27-2008 09:45 PM
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Tom Offline
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Post: #4
RE: WHY so many diffrent ways ?
colchiro Wrote:I've seen +-+-+-+-+- in a series cell where there was 2 volts on the cell. (2 volts for each +- pair is optimal for a series cell.)

Interesting. Maybe it was not a common bath setup. Or the voltage was reduced to 2 Volts electronically, outside of the container?
06-27-2008 11:29 PM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #5
RE: WHY so many diffrent ways ?
Tom... or bad design?Blush

I saw it on the Chris V6 series cell.

Rick

Links: Documents / Tuning for Mileage | Toyota Sensors | Autoshop Sensor Tutorials
06-28-2008 05:37 AM
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jksav7 Offline
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Post: #6
RE: WHY so many diffrent ways ?
Like Colchiro said, all you have to do is divide the 14 volts the battery makes by 7. So you'll have 7 separate baths of electrolyte, and you can have any number of plates within each bath just as long as each + plate gets 2 volts wired to it and each - plate the same.


Tom Wrote:
colchiro Wrote:I've seen +-+-+-+-+- in a series cell where there was 2 volts on the cell. (2 volts for each +- pair is optimal for a series cell.)

Interesting. Maybe it was not a common bath setup. Or the voltage was reduced to 2 Volts electronically, outside of the container?
06-28-2008 06:13 AM
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cmac Offline
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Post: #7
RE: WHY so many diffrent ways ?
What happens if you stack your sets vertically within the same bath?
06-28-2008 07:22 AM
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jksav7 Offline
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Post: #8
RE: WHY so many diffrent ways ?
Then you'll see way less gas production and more heating due to parasitic voltage losses. This has been discussed on other threads.


cmac Wrote:What happens if you stack your sets vertically within the same bath?
06-28-2008 07:57 AM
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CitatioN10 Offline
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Post: #9
RE: WHY so many diffrent ways ?
HMMM I'm so confused now , I got a PWM from PWM power and went to see the owner today , he told me I need to run it +-+-+-+-+-+- but I havent got the PWM ready yet , , but before I do all of this plate building I need to know how to wire them ..


Idea's ?
06-30-2008 03:41 PM
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Nick_Greyden Offline
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Post: #10
RE: WHY so many diffrent ways ?
The thing is do you want 2 volts or do you want X current or do you want X Wattage. This is something that has been kicking around in my head for quite a while now that I can't get out. Is it not the current passed through the electrolytes in the water that breaks the molecules up into HHO? If this is the case, the it is just the potential differance of the plates (Voltage) giving the current some place to run to to carry out their path and...

IF THAT IS THE CASE

then of course you could place the plates closer together, run a lower voltage per plate and thus have more plates. You could also run a transformer and up the voltage x2 and double your plates, however this would cause current to drop. The question then becomes do you need more ampage to split the molecules or is current amperage enough to speed them along their way. Once again....

IF THIS IS THE CASE

You are looking for a specific Wattage, not a voltage OR an amperage.

A whole lot of "if's" in there, but food for thought none-the-less
06-30-2008 11:42 PM
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