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restricting dry cell current leaks
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mtnhillsman Offline
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Post: #1
restricting dry cell current leaks
So i have all this material and am constructing a few dry cells, had an idea for minimizing the current leakage. Wondering if anybody has tried this or has any ideas...

Typical dry cells you have 2 holes drilled, one upper, one lower, straight through all the plates and one end wall. My first question is, if i go this route, how big do these holes need to be(or really how small can i get away with)??

My idea was instead of having the upper and lower holes straight through, stagger them, so say your solution comes in in the bottom right, first plate has a hole in the bottom right, next plate has a hole in the bottom left, next has a hole in the bottom right, so on and so fourth. Same thing with the gas outlet holes on the top.

It would seem to me that in this configuration the leaking current would have to pass through much more electrolyte(longer distance) and therefore reduce it.
02-28-2009 05:19 PM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #2
RE: restricting dry cell current leaks
Staggering is the preferred method.

If your water doesn't go above the top hole, do you need to stagger that too?

Rick

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02-28-2009 07:51 PM
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jbalat Offline
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Post: #3
RE: restricting dry cell current leaks
You need to look at the way the Smack does it..

Do not drill any holes through the plates until you see his videos...
02-28-2009 10:53 PM
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mtnhillsman Offline
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RE: restricting dry cell current leaks
(02-28-2009 07:51 PM)colchiro Wrote:  Staggering is the preferred method.

If your water doesn't go above the top hole, do you need to stagger that too?

I guess not, I was thinking the same thing. it is hard to say where the water level will be though since you can't see it. I'd think that the water from below fed from the bottom hole will rise as much as possible and would only fall just enough to let the gas escape. if that is true then you'd still have a current leak for whatever portion of the upper hole is submerged. does that sound right??

what about the hole size?? is 1/4" ok or could I go smaller??

thanks...
03-01-2009 05:55 AM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #5
RE: restricting dry cell current leaks
I'd be comfortable with that size.

Rick

Links: Documents / Tuning for Mileage | Toyota Sensors | Autoshop Sensor Tutorials
03-01-2009 07:02 AM
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benny Offline
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Post: #6
RE: restricting dry cell current leaks
(03-01-2009 05:55 AM)mtnhillsman Wrote:  
(02-28-2009 07:51 PM)colchiro Wrote:  Staggering is the preferred method.

If your water doesn't go above the top hole, do you need to stagger that too?

I guess not, I was thinking the same thing. it is hard to say where the water level will be though since you can't see it. I'd think that the water from below fed from the bottom hole will rise as much as possible and would only fall just enough to let the gas escape. if that is true then you'd still have a current leak for whatever portion of the upper hole is submerged. does that sound right??

what about the hole size?? is 1/4" ok or could I go smaller??

thanks...


As well as a second separate bubbler, I use a combined bubbler/reservoir system. i.e. HHO from the generator is fed into the bubbler/reservoir unit at about the midpoint of the level of electrolyte in the bubbler. Return from the bottom of this combined unit goes to the bottom of the generator and maintains the electrolyte level in the generator.

What I have found is that the difference in height between the HHO outlet of the generator and the level of the electrolyte in the bubbler, head height, can make a huge difference in the way that the generator operates.

With a large difference in height, large head, the generator tends to throw a fair amount of electrolyte out with the HHO, sometimes as foam. With a small difference in height, small head, there is less pressure difference due to level, and the electrolyte level in the generator drops to a point where little electrolyte is expelled, with the HHO gas, from the generator. Bonus - no foam. i.e. the greater the head of electrolyte, the greater the flow of electrolyte to the generator, and the greater the volume of electrolyte expelled with the HHO.

From observation, having tried various outlet hole diameters, it would seem to make little difference what size the top holes in your plates are. Once the gas has driven the electrolyte to a level lower than the gas outlet holes, you should have practically no current loss across these. Staggering these outlet holes also appears to make little or no difference.

Note that, as well as reservoir head height, the volume of HHO generated also appears to make a difference. With higher HHO production rates, there is slightly lower electrolyte level in the generator, and less electrolyte expelled from the generator.

If you can set up for a reasonable balance between reservoir head height, plate outlet hole size, and HHO production rate, you should have few problems.


Also aim to have the outlet holes as near the top of your plates as possible to maximise plate usage. Stick to near one corner of the plates. That way you can also experiment with using your generator in 'diamond' configuration. (ie tilted 45 degrees)


As for the bottom holes, if used, these only need to be of sufficient size to allow for electrolyte replenishment during normal operation, and, since these will be submerged, then, as Colchiro says, it is definitely recommended that these holes should be staggered.
(This post was last modified: 03-01-2009 08:30 AM by benny.)
03-01-2009 08:25 AM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #7
RE: restricting dry cell current leaks
You'll have to report back how that staggered bottom hole works out for you with the cell rotated 45 degrees. Wink

Rick

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03-01-2009 02:06 PM
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benny Offline
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Post: #8
RE: restricting dry cell current leaks
(03-01-2009 02:06 PM)colchiro Wrote:  You'll have to report back how that staggered bottom hole works out for you with the cell rotated 45 degrees. Wink

Doesn't make a whole lot of difference. The bottom holes, if set low enough, will still be submerged, and will still help equalize electrolyte level in the cells.
Have tried this, and still works as with non-rotated generator. Little or no gain in HHO output for same current level..
(This post was last modified: 03-01-2009 02:56 PM by benny.)
03-01-2009 02:54 PM
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colchiro Offline
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Post: #9
RE: restricting dry cell current leaks
My point: if tipped 45°, one of your bottom holes will still be on the bottom, the other half-way up your cell on the side. I suspect it'll still work, since you should be able keep your cell at least half full of electrolyte. It's just not a symmetrical fill hole.

Rick

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03-01-2009 05:38 PM
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mtnhillsman Offline
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Post: #10
RE: restricting dry cell current leaks
It would seem to me that since gravity is feeding the electrolyte in and both fill holes are well below where you want your electrolyte to be, it really shouldnt make a difference. After i decide how to drill my precious stainless ill test thoroughly and post my results.

**Dumb question edited out.....**
(This post was last modified: 03-10-2009 09:55 AM by mtnhillsman.)
03-01-2009 08:38 PM
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